Very interesting topic. Karlous Miller says he would sell 85 south in a heartbeat cuz he could make another
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Black Businesses: Build To Sell Or Build To Keep?
Timberland and Swizz sold Verzuz for like 300M. I didn't like that particular move because Verzuz is an original unique concept unlike a podcast platform. I think they should've kept it for the culture in that case
they sold at the right time. When they sold, the world was back outside and the events were getting stale. It didn't help when some artists showed up hours late or intoxicated. Logistic issues.
i would sell too. my top priority would be to make sure my family is straight and with the right check amount, it'll do that.
Selling in its own right is not bad but selling to an outsider is. Because when you sell to an outsider you’re essentially delivering your people on a platter to be exploits outside group.
If you want to sell, sell to someone in the same group. If you sell it to an outside group that just looks at it as a revenue opportunity they will not value it. That’s why Versuz is so garbage because the people that bought it don’t care or relate to the culture.
It’s going to end up being ran into the ground and shut down. I would rather see Black Americans think about long-term legacy and build successors so that entities exist beyond one person or generation.
If you want to sell, sell to someone in the same group. If you sell it to an outside group that just looks at it as a revenue opportunity they will not value it. That’s why Versuz is so garbage because the people that bought it don’t care or relate to the culture.
It’s going to end up being ran into the ground and shut down. I would rather see Black Americans think about long-term legacy and build successors so that entities exist beyond one person or generation.
If you have an entity that is generating revenue M/M why sell it for a single payout and/or royalty? Why not maintain the entity and pass it down to your children?
Yes, they definitely struck when the iron was hot and probably got the optimal bag...but again that particular product is too unique and vital to hip hop culture to cash out imo. They could have supplemented that 300M through more sponsorship more endorsements and things of that nature. Verzuz was too hip hop to give away imo
There is a wrong answer if we want to have an economic base and it’s to keep our creations. If we sell everything that’s successful to white people we will never have anything.
Building a business to sell is one of the principle strategies that we're taught in business school. When it's done right (BET, Tumblr, AOL, Def Jam, Motown, Yahoo!, for example), it can make the company's owner(s)/shareholders a ton of money!
If 85 South ever does get sold, Karlous Miller & the fellas will be eating for a long time.
If 85 South ever does get sold, Karlous Miller & the fellas will be eating for a long time.
I agree i agree..but to karlous miller's point we're so creative we can "make another Hov" after selling out
Build to keep & pass down to our future generations, is my answer! With a NEVER SELL clause, of course!
it really depends on the project. I work on a variety of projects and ideas. So it just really depends how I feel about it. but with the money, it can be passed down and invested in something my kids are passioned about.
i don't think it's a wrong answer. it just depends.
How many people have you seen sell a business and they make another one of equal statutes. When you find a niche like Versuz how many times you think you going to strike gold like that again? People that do it consistently like Elon Musk are government subsidized.
People like to tell themselves that but if you doing it for Black people and you sell to a non-Black person you just sold out.
WhipsAndChains
Sixer
Buy to sell has been the blue print for Russel Simmons and his mentees, like Jay-Z for a while... it's also been the model for Grocery Stores on the east coast for decades, especially Bodegas. Sell the business, Keep the property (intellectual and real estate) I think this model works for influencers and artist, because they are the business. I don't think the same rules apply for contractors, service man etc.
yeah, i see your point. for me, i see nothing wrong with buying and selling brands.
but if it's an industry.. like oil, textiles, etc., we should keep it. and these are necessary things we need in our economy.
imo.
i personally didn't see a long term vision for Versuz. its so niche, i think it was a product perfect for the time. but that's it.
Niche doesn’t mean it can’t be a long-term venture. Versuz is basically taking a battle rap format and applying it to other genres. It personally sucks to me but I think it could have continued if they continued to innovate and build a solid management team around it.
Nah man, having legends battle catalogs is an everlasting idea. It wasn't just some pandemic boredom shit, that's a viable concept for the rest of time
There’s a lot of nuance to each black businesses situation that makes me say it depends. For example 85 South is simply a podcast, there’s a million of those, so he’s right when he says he can make another one, barring any clause that prohibits doing so, and anything that it can expand into doesn’t require actually owning the 85 South podcast. Compare that to a company like OpenAi for example, if they wanted to create their own search engine to compete with Google, it would serve them best to keep the infrastructure of ChatGPT and turn that into a search engine rather than take the capital and start from scratch.
If the upfront capital serves you best then do it but if not no. Some of these decisions I see as foolish, and that’s before I look at the the racial component. Selling QC seems dumb, I’d imagine over the course of 10 years the Migos and Lil Baby’s catalogs would make around a billion in 10 years. The company that bought QC definitely has a plan to turn a profit. Once you factor in the racial component of the music industry it makes this decision look 10x worse.
I also didn’t agree with Jay Z selling Tidal, Tidal was the #3 streaming platform in a new and rapidly growing industry. That’s an example of the infrastructure could’ve served you better in expanding. Just take a look at Spotify which aims one day to compete with YouTube. A company like Tidal could’ve grown to encompass multiple media & tech subsidiaries. It had way much more potential than what he sold it for.
If the upfront capital serves you best then do it but if not no. Some of these decisions I see as foolish, and that’s before I look at the the racial component. Selling QC seems dumb, I’d imagine over the course of 10 years the Migos and Lil Baby’s catalogs would make around a billion in 10 years. The company that bought QC definitely has a plan to turn a profit. Once you factor in the racial component of the music industry it makes this decision look 10x worse.
I also didn’t agree with Jay Z selling Tidal, Tidal was the #3 streaming platform in a new and rapidly growing industry. That’s an example of the infrastructure could’ve served you better in expanding. Just take a look at Spotify which aims one day to compete with YouTube. A company like Tidal could’ve grown to encompass multiple media & tech subsidiaries. It had way much more potential than what he sold it for.
I would only sell something in the beginning to get my credit, my adult children's credit straight & pay off their school loans, that's it!
D
Deleted member 1946
Guest
I think it depends. Build to keep if it is your passion. Build to sell if a person wants a new career path.
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Deleted member 1946
Guest
I disagree. It served it's purpose and they sold it at the right time. Sometimes black people have to sell a product to get enough liquid cash to invest into other ventures - it's part of wealth building.
Jay is a capitalist without a vision. Just look at his career. He's not known for original ideas. lol
for comparsion, look at Steve Jobs. He was a visionary.
i agree that it's a bad move to sell catalogs. because I think in the near future, we're going back to a physical medium where physical sales will be relevant again. Just a gut feeling.
I can definitely see his point.... I would sell my business (depending on the price) because I could definitely do the same thing again...
I try not to be in someone else's pockets but for me, I would NEVER sell anything related to our culture to any non black and not to any black who I think would eventually sell to a non black.
Other groups try very hard not to sell businesses that represents their culture like their media. We should be controlling any business that represents black culture: music, movies, newspapers, radio, tv, etc.
If we are making widgets and the market is maturing, sell it to any non black willing to buy it. If I had a chain of Blockbuster Videos back in the day and peeped that it was going to be irrelevant then sell. But if I had BET, Def Jam, Versuz, a black hair business, etc, things that are directly connected to black culture. Hell nah. Not selling it and if I suspect my own kids wouldn't respect it, I wouldn't leave it to them, they'd have some other cash or assets like property or whatever.
Other groups try very hard not to sell businesses that represents their culture like their media. We should be controlling any business that represents black culture: music, movies, newspapers, radio, tv, etc.
If we are making widgets and the market is maturing, sell it to any non black willing to buy it. If I had a chain of Blockbuster Videos back in the day and peeped that it was going to be irrelevant then sell. But if I had BET, Def Jam, Versuz, a black hair business, etc, things that are directly connected to black culture. Hell nah. Not selling it and if I suspect my own kids wouldn't respect it, I wouldn't leave it to them, they'd have some other cash or assets like property or whatever.
tbh, how many black-owned B1-minded millionaires out there with the ability to buy up black brands?
Not very many... but I still wouldn't sell to a non-black entity... just a preference...
When I was growing up, my community was ALL BLACK. Stores, cleaners, laundromat, gas stations, policemen, firemen, restaurants, clubs, movie theaters, banks, Boys & Girls Clubs, YMCA, YWCA, libraries, etc.
Casper showed up with his checkbook & Blacks sold-out & that should've NEVER happened!
The biggest problem I see with our millionaire or billionaire business owners like Robert Smith, Oprah, Byron Allen is they want white acceptance. Robert Smith and Byron Allen are married to Becky.
Their charity work is either white run things like breast cancer and if they donate to the black community it's 'acceptable' to white folks.
Michael Jordan gives big money to 'Make A Wish' foundation. Also, ambiguous things like 100 million to fight racial income disparity. Huh? Oprah spends money to school African kids. Oprah is all about black girls and women, I get it but why not a version of Dr. Umar's school for girls in any of the places she grew up (Mississippi or Milwaukee)? Cosby is from north Philadelphia, why not direct money there instead of Morehouse? Not saying Morehouse doesn't need it, any donation is fantastic, but I would like to see planned out charity work directed to the soil. Dr. Umar for all his faults is at least directing his school for the soil.
Things like funding a legal defense fund to go after these race soldiers. Things like schools like Dr. Umar, okay, you don't think he's the right guy, fund your own.
Jewish billionaires give big money to Israel directly. Latino businessmen build up their own community directly. Koreans and Chinese as well.
Our 1% class isn't dedicated to the soil, all the other groups are. What ever you think of Tariq, Dr. Boyce, Dr. Umar, TBA, tell me they wouldn't do a helluva lot more with the same money that Robert Smith, Oprah or Cosby have? A lot more impact on the black community?
Their charity work is either white run things like breast cancer and if they donate to the black community it's 'acceptable' to white folks.
Michael Jordan gives big money to 'Make A Wish' foundation. Also, ambiguous things like 100 million to fight racial income disparity. Huh? Oprah spends money to school African kids. Oprah is all about black girls and women, I get it but why not a version of Dr. Umar's school for girls in any of the places she grew up (Mississippi or Milwaukee)? Cosby is from north Philadelphia, why not direct money there instead of Morehouse? Not saying Morehouse doesn't need it, any donation is fantastic, but I would like to see planned out charity work directed to the soil. Dr. Umar for all his faults is at least directing his school for the soil.
Things like funding a legal defense fund to go after these race soldiers. Things like schools like Dr. Umar, okay, you don't think he's the right guy, fund your own.
Jewish billionaires give big money to Israel directly. Latino businessmen build up their own community directly. Koreans and Chinese as well.
Our 1% class isn't dedicated to the soil, all the other groups are. What ever you think of Tariq, Dr. Boyce, Dr. Umar, TBA, tell me they wouldn't do a helluva lot more with the same money that Robert Smith, Oprah or Cosby have? A lot more impact on the black community?
D
Deleted member 1946
Guest
I personally don't think those billionaire people you named are allowed to do anything that will truly lead Black folks anywhere. They are of the Boule class. The system has some very big dirt on them which is why they are allowed to be in that top tier class. When our folks do become millionaires and have something substantial that is truly for the people, they are watched like a hawk. That's why those other people you mentioned are not on Oprah, Robert Smith or Byron Allen's financial level. When our good people get on that level, we better have excellent protection, think tanks and great allies who have resources as well.
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Deleted member 1946
Guest
It is sad how we don't understand this is a form of warfare. We keep getting bought off.
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Deleted member 1946
Guest
One more thing...I wish we can get back to this time. With all these illegals being allowed to come over here, we need to patronize and by from Black folks who really care about us.
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Deleted member 1946
Guest
Of course it won't. Some people will never learn. I miss some of the shows BET had that were scrapped due to being too much for our culture.
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Deleted member 1946
Guest
That's a good question. I don't know the answer to that. Too many Boule MFs out here. It is ridiculous.
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Deleted member 1946
Guest
Same thing I say. I do know there are more sellout Black millionaires than non-Black sellout millionaires. I don't know the percentages of each.
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Deleted member 1946
Guest
A portion does not reveal what percent. It is intentionally vague.
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Deleted member 1946
Guest
I say the same thing. I do know what they will do. They will get a Black flunky to "buy the Black company" with money that was given by the White folks. Then the White folks will turn around and buy it from the Black flunky.
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Well that's a business decision. Personally I'd rather see us start forgoing the quick money and look farther down the road.
That won't happen because of human nature. We want to be rich now.
We would rather a few of us be rich now than a few of us be well off now vs the majority of us are successful, wealthy or well of down the line.
Once millions are in the equation nobody is still thinking black empowerment or morals and values. Very few people are that principled!
That won't happen because of human nature. We want to be rich now.
We would rather a few of us be rich now than a few of us be well off now vs the majority of us are successful, wealthy or well of down the line.
Once millions are in the equation nobody is still thinking black empowerment or morals and values. Very few people are that principled!
D
Deleted member 1946
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Yep. And they do things to try and uplift their people as well. We need to do the same thing. Positive children's programming. Positive programming for Black men. Positive programming for Black women.
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Deleted member 1946
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Yep. The Blacks at the top don't want a lot of us to be successful. Why? Because their position at the top will be in jeopardy.
D