The Cookout

[ChiefRocka]

How do black men and women view each other in context to our overall existence? Are we moreso looking at each other as the same or are we very different and is that ok? Do we acknowledge those differences in our expectations of one another or are we failing in that? I'd like to gauge the perspective of black folks on intimate partner relationships.

 

[Jay]

How do black men and women view each other in context to our overall existence? Are we moreso looking at each other as the same or are we very different and is that ok? Do we acknowledge those differences in our expectations of one another or are we failing in that? I'd like to gauge the perspective of black folks on intimate partner relationships.

Are you talking about Black American men and women?

 

[Sovereign]

How do black men and women view each other in context to our overall existence? Are we moreso looking at each other as the same or are we very different and is that ok? Do we acknowledge those differences in our expectations of one another or are we failing in that? I'd like to gauge the perspective of black folks on intimate partner relationships.

The USA has always been irrational and it permeates all the way down into every aspect of society. Right now the government is trying to split Black men and Black women into two separate social groups but fortunately Black American culture is starting to push back.

 

[equis]

I think rationality has been taken out of black relationships due to years of programing and the appearance of movements such as feminism, corporate culture, and MGTOW. Men and women in our communities are stepping outside of their roles and have made up ample excuses for it. Many of our sisters have adopted a masculine persona which eats at them to the point they're having to be drugged up to reach mental equilibrium because keeping that up is so draining. Many of our brothers have become more feminine in order to seem non threatening and to please the dominant society, meanwhile they become more resentful from the disrespect and disregard they're being dished out. Things are quickly becoming backwards and androgynous on our sides and it's just madness all around.

 

[ChiefRocka]

Are you talking about Black American men and women?

Absolutely. The question is intentionally broad but my focus is black Americans.

 

[ChiefRocka]

The USA has always been irrational and it permeates all the way down into every aspect of society. Right now the government is trying to split Black men and Black women into two separate social groups but fortunately Black American culture is starting to push back.

I agree. However I would argue our society is design by rational even though the rules change when it comes to black people. Question: do you think the divide that is being created is an exploitation of the natural differences between blk men and women or are men and women mentally operating the same?

 

[ChiefRocka]

I think rationality has been taken out of black relationships due to years of programing and the appearance of movements such as feminism, corporate culture, and MGTOW. Men and women in our communities are stepping outside of their roles and have made up ample excuses for it. Many of our sisters have adopted a masculine persona which eats at them to the point they're having to be drugged up to reach mental equilibrium because keeping that up is so draining. Many of our brothers have become more feminine in order to seem non threatening and to please the dominant society, meanwhile they become more resentful from the disrespect and disregard they're being dished out. Things are quickly becoming backwards and androgynous on our sides and it's just madness all around.

I agree with everything you've stated. At one time black men and women didn't have a choice but to come together for the sake of survival. Today's societies are so advanced we can create a false reality similar to a matrix for ourselves with modern technology, social media ect. but is their a pathway forward? Can we evolve beyond our flaws? Some would say we can go back to the old ways but I don't believe it is possible, at least not at large.

 

[ChiefRocka]

How do you define rational thinking? Is our society rational? Is the univers rational? I don't believe that a universe that consists of mostly zeo gravity, black holes and is constantly expanding can be considered rational. Are men rational thinkers and what is it's purpose?

 

[Sovereign]

I agree. However I would argue our society is design by rational even though the rules change when it comes to black people. Question: do you think the divide that is being created is an exploitation of the natural differences between blk men and women or are men and women mentally operating the same?

What’s your opinion?

 

[RCNAL]

Men and women generally have never viewed each other the same. Even in northern European countries where they have made gender roles as ubiquitous as possible, people still treat the other gender according to traditional roles to some extent.

It's very difficult to undue 1000s of years of genetic evolution. With regards specifically to black men and women, when have ever not had issues with each other? That's' the norm, in all societies, even patriarchal ones.

What makes todays black men and women relationship different is that most kids are being raised by single moms and that has had a huge impact on how black girls and boys are raised and how they see themselves.

This impacts relationships later on. Girls I know who were raised with their fathers have different expectations of a man, they tend to date the alpha males more often and the guys who were raised by some single moms, not all, tend to look for women who will take care of them and be more of a leader.

This will sound like I'm caping for sistas but black males are way more emotional these days than in the past. This my unofficial view but it appears that way. Also, sistas are far more combative to black males than they are to non black males and I attest that to most growing up without any significant black male role model. No father in the home, rarely any black male teachers throughout K-12, no black male has played an authoritative part in anything in their lives, so they don't respect black men as much. Their interaction is dating and that is often to a black male who has been raised by a black woman who made him more feminine than he otherwise would be in a 2 parent home. There I said it....haha.

 

[ChiefRocka]

Men and women generally have never viewed each other the same. Even in northern European countries where they have made gender roles as ubiquitous as possible, people still treat the other gender according to traditional roles to some extent.

It's very difficult to undue 1000s of years of genetic evolution. With regards specifically to black men and women, when have ever not had issues with each other? That's' the norm, in all societies, even patriarchal ones.

What makes todays black men and women relationship different is that most kids are being raised by single moms and that has had a huge impact on how black girls and boys are raised and how they see themselves.

This impacts relationships later on. Girls I know who were raised with their fathers have different expectations of a man, they tend to date the alpha males more often and the guys who were raised by some single moms, not all, tend to look for women who will take care of them and be more of a leader.

This will sound like I'm caping for sistas but black males are way more emotional these days than in the past. This my unofficial view but it appears that way. Also, sistas are far more combative to black males than they are to non black males and I attest that to most growing up without any significant black male role model. No father in the home, rarely any black male teachers throughout K-12, no black male has played an authoritative part in anything in their lives, so they don't respect black men as much. Their interaction is dating and that is often to a black male who has been raised by a black woman who made him more feminine than he otherwise would be in a 2 parent home. There I said it....haha.

I think that is a brilliant assessment. Ultimately, men and women have the same needs and desires but their lived experiences are causing them to seek them out in different ways. As you have expressed it often comes down to parenting and a lack of a father. Are these women looking for a father in an intimate partner? Are these men raised raised by single mothers looking for a mother in intimate partner relationships? A lot of toxic relationships involve at least one very controlling IP. Are adult men and women capable of growing past these insecure behaviors?

 

[equis]

I agree with everything you've stated. At one time black men and women didn't have a choice but to come together for the sake of survival. Today's societies are so advanced we can create a false reality similar to a matrix for ourselves with modern technology, social media ect. but is their a pathway forward? Can we evolve beyond our flaws? Some would say we can go back to the old ways but I don't believe it is possible, at least not at large.

I came across an interesting channel that discusses the gender wars in interesting light. It was a sister called The Crimson Cure. She divides black folks into two categories. The Lions and Lionesses on one side and the hyenas on the other. The Lions and Lionesses want to stick together and build the pride (the black community), while the hyenas plot against the black community and yet constantly try to feed on the spoils of the pride and pretend they're one of us. We have to alienate these hyenas when we see that divisive, self serving hyena behavior. I think that's where we start.

 

[Sapphire]

A lot of women in America, no matter black or otherwise, are not rational thinkers, they are emotional thinkers. Because they spend time following their emotions, they tend to be unstable with their decisions. I see this all the time. I feel like they want women out here like this because they are easier to control and manipulate not only for men but for the state/government. They want us all cogs in a machine.

 

[Barida]

How do you define rational thinking? Is our society rational? Is the univers rational? I don't believe that a universe that consists of mostly zeo gravity, black holes and is constantly expanding can be considered rational. Are men rational thinkers and what is it's purpose?

Rationality has been thrown under the bus in the world where being woke is the order of the day. Feminism, Gender rights and Gay rights have made it difficult for people in general to act rational. Sometimes, I feel there is more the Black Community should do in teaching our younger kids what life is all about.

 

[ChiefRocka]

I believe men are by nature rational thinkers and women are by nature irrational thinkers. We are two halves of a whole and we are meant to experience and grow emotionally and mentally from one another. Typically if a women has strong relationships with men growing up she will have a greater ability to function rationally and men who have strong relationships with women have a greater emotional stability. I think we make the mistake in modern times of adopting ideologies like MGTOW and feminism that attempt to force men and boys to behave like women and vise versa women and girls to behave like men. The intent is to bring us closer together but It is based in fear and self preservation.

What’s your opinion?

 

[ChiefRocka]

Rationality has been thrown under the bus in the world where being woke is the order of the day. Feminism, Gender rights and Gay rights have made it difficult for people in general to act rational. Sometimes, I feel there is more the Black Community should do in teaching our younger kids what life is all about.

It is easy to dismiss a lot of these intersectionalist ideologies because much of what they preach is outrageous and irrational. However, many black women have expressed that our relationships are lacking particularly in their emotional fulfillment. This is in my opinion what draws many of them to these backwards ways of thinking. Many women attempt to appeal to a mans emotions, thinking this is the best way to express what their needs are but they don't see that we are not emotional thinkers and they fail to get through to us.

 

[ChiefRocka]

I believe men are by nature rational thinkers and women are by nature irrational thinkers. We are two halves of a whole and we are meant to experience and grow emotionally and mentally from one another. Typically if a women has strong relationships with men growing up she will have a greater ability to function rationally and men who have strong relationships with women have a greater emotional stability. I think we make the mistake in modern times of adopting ideologies like MGTOW and feminism that attempt to force men and boys to behave like women and vise versa women and girls to behave like men. The intent is to bring us closer together but It is based in fear and self preservation. These women you speak of are easy targets for feminist because they are too afraid to move past their traumas and deal with the possibility of loss. Women have a lot more to lose than men before marriage and that is understandable but they don't know the only way forward is through.

 

[Red Velvet]

It is easy to dismiss a lot of these intersectionalist ideologies because much of what they preach is outrageous and irrational. However, many black women have expressed that our relationships are lacking particularly in their emotional fulfillment. This is in my opinion what draws many of them to these backwards ways of thinking. Many women attempt to appeal to a mans emotions, thinking this is the best way to express what their needs are but they don't see that we are not emotional thinkers and they fail to get through to us.

In a utopian society you may be right but some times have we cannot get through intellectually either. Sometimes the nature of simply being a woman invalidates my contribution in the eyes of SOME men.

 

[ChiefRocka]

I came across an interesting channel that discusses the gender wars in interesting light. It was a sister called The Crimson Cure. She divides black folks into two categories. The Lions and Lionesses on one side and the hyenas on the other. The Lions and Lionesses want to stick together and build the pride (the black community), while the hyenas plot against the black community and yet constantly try to feed on the spoils of the pride and pretend they're one of us. We have to alienate these hyenas when we see that divisive, self serving hyena behavior. I think that's where we starWe can

I came across an interesting channel that discusses the gender wars in interesting light. It was a sister called The Crimson Cure. She divides black folks into two categories. The Lions and Lionesses on one side and the hyenas on the other. The Lions and Lionesses want to stick together and build the pride (the black community), while the hyenas plot against the black community and yet constantly try to feed on the spoils of the pride and pretend they're one of us. We have to alienate these hyenas when we see that divisive, self serving hyena behavior. I think that's where we start.

We can certainly go down that route and in some cases we may have to however, I am more interested in the why? What makes these people this way. I would argue these hyenas are the most desperate of us. Their behavior is really a cry for help. They act on jealousy and envy. They are scared little children acting out because they haven't matured to a place where they can see things for what they are. Then comes the question are they salvageable and how? I would say yes. These people are operating from unfulfilled needs but it takes someone with a greater level of understanding to deal with this, lest you be dragged down with them.

 

[ChiefRocka]

In a utopian society you may be right but some times have we cannot get through intellectually either. Sometimes the nature of simply being a woman invalidates my contribution in the eyes of SOME men.

There is more work that needs to be done with men and our understanding of what women need. There is no doubt about that but women need to understand that they have a role to play in this as well. We are way too dense to tap into the same level of emotional intelligence as a women. We don't even fully understand our own emotional needs but we don't need to. When it comes to this aspect of life women are supposed to be the ones PULLING THE STRINGS. You are supposed to be the ones nurturing us so that we can return that energy back to you. After all, you cannot give what you do not have.

 

[Red Velvet]

There is more work that needs to be done with men and our understanding of what women need. There is no doubt about that but women need to understand that they have a role to play in this as well. We are way too dense to tap into the same level of emotional intelligence as a women. We don't even fully understand our own emotional needs but we don't need to. When it comes to this aspect of life women are supposed to be the ones PULLING THE STRINGS. You are supposed to be the ones nurturing us so that we can return that energy back to you. After all, you cannot give what you do not have.

If you as a man don’t understand your own emotions you cannot proper lead a woman or a relationship. Emotions are too important in decision making to leave it up to someone who cannot understand their emotions which lead them to not being able to control them either.

I also disagree with men not needling to understand their emotions. Men are our warrior class, you cannot go into battle in my defense and be of any good if you don’t understand and control your emotions.

You need to be the one that’s able to be calm even when you’re scared, hopeless, and uncertain.

You need to be the one that remains calm when the bills are 300 and we have 200 in the bank.

Understanding your emotions, regulating them, and using them to make sound decisions is critical to you being a man worthy of being in a household leadership role. Many of you confuse suppressing your emotions with controlling and understanding and those of you that do so have some of the craziest breakdowns and fits of violence.

 

[ChiefRocka]

If you as a man don’t understand your own emotions you cannot proper lead a woman or a relationship. Emotions are too important in decision making to leave it up to someone who cannot understand their emotions which lead them to not being able to control them either.

I also disagree with men not needling to understand their emotions. Men are our warrior class, you cannot go into battle in my defense and be of any good if you don’t understand and control your emotions.

You need to be the one that’s able to be calm even when you’re scared, hopeless, and uncertain.

You need to be the one that remains calm when the bills are 300 and we have 200 in the bank.

Understanding your emotions, regulating them, and using them to make sound decisions is critical to you being a man worthy of being in a household leadership role. Many of you confuse suppressing your emotions with controlling and understanding and those of you that do so have some of the craziest breakdowns and fits of violence.

We are two halves of the same whole. A man CANNOT gain emotional stability without first learning it through a women. Boys who have no or bad relationship with women grow up to be maniacs. I am not saying men do not need to understand their emotions but please understand we can NEVER gain this on our own. Their is a reason why incels spend all their time hating women and targeting them with violence. Expecting a man to be of high emotional intelligence on his own is the same as expecting a man to be a women and that expectation is usually out of fear. Women are rejecting their responsibility because it forces them to be vulnerable. You can't claim men suppressing their emotions is wrong, then say men need to be calm when we are scared. What you don't understand is it is not supression it's a survival instinct. It comes natural to men. You believe you understand it but you don't. You don't have a high rational stability because you are not a man.

 

[equis]

We can certainly go down that route and in some cases we may have to however, I am more interested in the why? What makes these people this way. I would argue these hyenas are the most desperate of us. Their behavior is really a cry for help. They act on jealousy and envy. They are scared little children acting out because they haven't matured to a place where they can see things for what they are. Then comes the question are they salvageable and how? I would say yes. These people are operating from unfulfilled needs but it takes someone with a greater level of understanding to deal with this, lest you be dragged down with them.

It truly is like a drowning victim. It takes someone skilled in those kinds of emotional manoeuvers to be of any help to them. Many things form these kinds of mindsets. Upbringing of course is a broad term, but you could even look into how the relationship between one's mother and father forms the mind. That's one reason I always advise guys to ask any woman they talk to about their relationships (or lack thereof) with their mother and father. Then also there's the sociological factor. White supremacy studies us and is well aware of the issues in our communities and how to inflame them with things like overturning power dynamics and incentivuzing certain destructive behaviors. So this is a deep rabbit hole to delve into.

But all that to say, I do believe there's hope for some. I've seen it with my own eyes. But I've also seen the dire consequences of trying to help someone who doesn't want to help themselves. We have a large population of our people that are under the category of not wanting to help themselves. So many of our people are afraid of themselves and can't stand themselves, and from this lack of confidence comes inflated egos and various neurotic tendencies. So my advise is always to put effort into those who show that they want change. We don't have enough armchairs to try to force people to sit down and deal with their issues. Besides, the people that often need therapy and aid the most will deny it the fastest.

 

[Barida]

It is easy to dismiss a lot of these intersectionalist ideologies because much of what they preach is outrageous and irrational. However, many black women have expressed that our relationships are lacking particularly in their emotional fulfillment. This is in my opinion what draws many of them to these backwards ways of thinking. Many women attempt to appeal to a mans emotions, thinking this is the best way to express what their needs are but they don't see that we are not emotional thinkers and they fail to get through to us.

It is difficult nowadays for men to express their emotional sides in order to avoid being taken for granted. What I think is that men should connect with women that have high interest in them as that is one way they can get to have a lasting relationships. Some of these women are more focused on what they can get from their relationship with men and less about what they bring to the table.

 

[ChiefRocka]

It is difficult nowadays for men to express their emotional sides in order to avoid being taken for granted. What I think is that men should connect with women that have high interest in them as that is one way they can get to have a lasting relationships. Some of these women are more focused on what they can get from their relationship with men and less about what they bring to the table.

Yes. On the surface this is what you will get from all women. It is a very vulnerable thing to be submissive to a man and they are emotionally as well as socially incentivized to see men as resources but most women will admit that is not enough to maintain them. Women say they want men to be more "emotionally available" or something similar but really what they are getting at is they have emotional needs that a man has yet to fulfill and it is eating at them.

 

[Jay]

We are two halves of the same whole. A man CANNOT gain emotional stability without first learning it through a women. Boys who have no or bad relationship with women grow up to be maniacs. I am not saying men do not need to understand their emotions but please understand we can NEVER gain this on our own. Their is a reason why incels spend all their time hating women and targeting them with violence. Expecting a man to be of high emotional intelligence on his own is the same as expecting a man to be a women and that expectation is usually out of fear. Women are rejecting their responsibility because it forces them to be vulnerable. You can't claim men suppressing their emotions is wrong, then say men need to be calm when we are scared. What you don't understand is it is not supression it's a survival instinct. It comes natural to men. You believe you understand it but you don't. You don't have a high rational stability because you are not a man.

I don’t agree with this. We have the ability to hone our emotional intelligence…the difference is that our decision making is led with our intellectual function whereas a lot of women lead with the emotional.

I feel that culture makes men think that emotion is synonymous with women but it’s not. We have emotion and use it just as much but our role in society doesn’t allow us to lead with our emotion.

Emotion helps us lead, it keeps us from taking undue risks, and so how can women teach us emotion when they don’t use it like we do.

Your mom may teach you empathy but not emotion.

 

[StayingHumble]

We live in a irrational world that poses as just and rational. It's the dichotomy that we have created to deal with the constant mixed messages we receive from an ever changing world . We profess justice and equal treatment but our actions show different. We can truly change for the better and I believe we can and will it's takes one person at a time just stay positive.

 

[ChiefRocka]

I don’t agree with this. We have the ability to hone our emotional intelligence…the difference is that our decision making is led with our intellectual function whereas a lot of women lead with the emotional.

I feel that culture makes men think that emotion is synonymous with women but it’s not. We have emotion and use it just as much but our role in society doesn’t allow us to lead with our emotion.

Emotion helps us lead, it keeps us from taking undue risks, and so how can women teach us emotion when they don’t use it like we do.

Your mom may teach you empathy but not emotion.

I certainly don't think a women can teach a man to use his emotions however, there is a process of maturation where young boys and girls must be emotionally stabilized. This cannot come from ones self and a man cannot instill emotional stability into a child anywhere close to the way a women can. The inverse is also true as women cannot instill rational stability the same way a man can. We can move forward in life and mature beyond just our child like needs but the human subconscious cares nothing for our maturation. It only sees it's needs and desires and those needs and desires will manifest negatively in some way if unfulfilled.

 

[Jay]

I certainly don't think a women can teach a man to use his emotions however, there is a process of maturation where young boys and girls must be emotionally stabilized. This cannot come from ones self and a man cannot instill emotional stability into a child anywhere close to the way a women can. The inverse is also true as women cannot instill rational stability the same way a man can. We can move forward in life and mature beyond just our child like needs but the human subconscious cares nothing for our maturation. It only sees it's needs and desires and those needs and desires will manifest negatively in some way if unfulfilled.

A man cannot insure emotional stability in boys?

Men are the ones that bring emotional stability into the household. That’s why boys that grow up without a father typical are overly emotional and are guided by it…the male provides the stability.

The whole male = rational, female = emotional to me is pseudo-science. You’re painting it as if all males are Spock until a woman is involved which is not true.

Both sexes have an emotional and intellectual function but our roles in society dictate which side we lean more on. Hence why women in situations where there is food or shelter insecurity begin to take on more masculine and rational behaviors.

 

[Harbinger]

We live in a irrational world that poses as just and rational. It's the dichotomy that we have created to deal with the constant mixed messages we receive from an ever changing world . We profess justice and equal treatment but our actions show different. We can truly change for the better and I believe we can and will it's takes one person at a time just stay positive.

Wouldn’t you say that socio-political layer is irrational? The actual laws of physics and all that are governed by it are very rational. Even white supremacy is rational to a degree even though it’s not just.

 

[mamluke13]

This is actually a very good book that delves into part of it
The Origins of Political Order by Francis fukuyama

 

[ChiefRocka]

Wouldn’t you say that socio-political layer is irrational? The actual laws of physics and all that are governed by it are very rational. Even white supremacy is rational to a degree even though it’s not just.

The laws of physics are rational but the universe as a whole does not adhere to the laws of physics. Man has constructed advanced societies that function on rationality but the universe as a whole is completely irrational. Simple concepts like up and down, left and right don't mean anything outside of the spec we call earth.

 

[Harbinger]

The laws of physics are rational but the universe as a whole does not adhere to the laws of physics. Man has constructed advanced societies that function on rationality but the universe as a whole is completely irrational. Simple concepts like up and down, left and right don't mean anything outside of the spec we call earth.

Simple concepts like up and down are words man uses to explain the universe as they perceive it. But what we perceive is clearly not the full explanation hence why our definitions are irrational but the universe is not.

 

[ChiefRocka]

A man cannot insure emotional stability in boys?

Men are the ones that bring emotional stability into the household. That’s why boys that grow up without a father typical are overly emotional and are guided by it…the male provides the stability.

The whole male = rational, female = emotional to me is pseudo-science. You’re painting it as if all males are Spock until a woman is involved which is not true.

Both sexes have an emotional and intellectual function but our roles in society dictate which side we lean more on. Hence why women in situations where there is food or shelter insecurity begin to take on more masculine and rational behavi

A man cannot insure emotional stability in boys?

Men are the ones that bring emotional stability into the household. That’s why boys that grow up without a father typical are overly emotional and are guided by it…the male provides the stability.

The whole male = rational, female = emotional to me is pseudo-science. You’re painting it as if all males are Spock until a woman is involved which is not true.

Both sexes have an emotional and intellectual function but our roles in society dictate which side we lean more on. Hence why women in situations where there is food or shelter insecurity begin to take on more masculine and rational behaviors.

I would say male = rational, female = irrational. Emotion is irrational. Our unique experience will of course shape who we are but the lens through which we process and see the world stays the same. Taking on the characteristics of something that you are not is an imitation not. Not gonna lie men are spock without women.

 

[ChiefRocka]

Simple concepts like up and down are words man uses to explain the universe as they perceive it. But what we perceive is clearly not the full explanation hence why our definitions are irrational but the universe is not.

Correct as WE perceive. Rational thinking is a human creation, it's like time. All it takes for something to be rational or true is for the collective to agree on it and eventually what was once true will change over time because it was never real beyond our perception.

 

[Jay]

I would say male = rational, female = irrational. Emotion is irrational. Our unique experience will of course shape who we are but the lens through which we process and see the world stays the same. Taking on the characteristics of something that you are not is an imitation not. Not gonna lie men are spock without women.

Emotion is not always irrational.

• Rational emotion: The fear you feel when on the edge of a cliff is very rational.
• Irrational emotion: Fearing all clowns in adulthood because one clown popped your dog shaped balloon as a child.

One emotion will save you from death, the other is not a reasonable response to a clown popping your balloon.

You’re simplifying Logic and Emotion to make it fit some binary box.

Emotion is every bit as important to rational decision making as logic.

 

[ChiefRocka]

If all you needed to save yourself was to feel fear then you would have nothing to be afraid of. Logic would be what tells you to back off from a cliff.

A person opens fire on a crowd and you are their with your family trying to think of a way to exit safely, emotion is your worst enemy. It will get you and your family killed. Women and children may react to a situation like this with great emotion but that won't help them. A man is expected to put his emotions aside and take action which can only be done when your mind is clear of emotion.

 

[Harbinger]

Correct as WE perceive. Rational thinking is a human creation, it's like time. All it takes for something to be rational or true is for the collective to agree on it and eventually what was once true will change over time because it was never real beyond our perception.

Is it a human creation or a human term used to explain how we perceive how we think?

 

[ChiefRocka]

Is it a human creation or a human term used to explain how we perceive how we think?

Perception is reality. If a tree falls in a forest and no one is around to hear it does it make a sound?

 

[Jay]

If all you needed to save yourself was to feel fear then you would have nothing to be afraid of. Logic would be what tells you to back off from a cliff.

A person opens fire on a crowd and you are their with your family trying to think of a way to exit safely, emotion is your worst enemy. It will get you and your family killed. Women and children may react to a situation like this with great emotion but that won't help them. A man is expected to put his emotions aside and take action which can only be done when your mind is clear of emotion.

You’re being slightly disingenuous in your explanations.

You need both Logic and Emotion to function, they are both required to make rational decisions. In the case of the cliff, the emotion lets you know that you are what your brain perceive to be a dangerous situation. This prompts you to pause and make an intellectual analysis of the situation to see the best course of action. People die because they ignored their fear or anxious emotions and ended up falling off the cliff, crashing their car, getting eaten by a bear, etc.

As far as combat, your emotion is important because it’s what lets you know you are in danger. But emotion is similar to a lot of things in life, too much of it can cause you to die. Water is required to live but if you drink too much you will die.

Emotion is the same way in combat. You have to regulate the emotion so that you don’t get tunnel vision and become so affixed to the danger that you can’t use your intellect. Martial Artists have to overcome this same thing to fight properly.

The emotion is not bad, it just has to be kept in control so that you can act. If shots ring out and you have ZERO emotion then why would you even act?

The emotion makes you think “oh shoot my family and I can die and I don’t want that so let me act”. You’re denigrating the importance of emotion because you over value intellect.

 

[Harbinger]

Perception is reality. If a tree falls in a forest and no one is around to hear it does it make a sound?

Perception is reality in a social context not in a universal context.

 

[ChiefRocka]

Perception is reality in a social context not in a universal context.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q1YqgPAtzho

 

[ChiefRocka]

You’re being slightly disingenuous in your explanations.

You need both Logic and Emotion to function, they are both required to make rational decisions. In the case of the cliff, the emotion lets you know that you are what your brain perceive to be a dangerous situation. This prompts you to pause and make an intellectual analysis of the situation to see the best course of action. People die because they ignored their fear or anxious emotions and ended up falling off the cliff, crashing their car, getting eaten by a bear, etc.

As far as combat, your emotion is important because it’s what lets you know you are in danger. But emotion is similar to a lot of things in life, too much of it can cause you to die. Water is required to live but if you drink too much you will die.

Emotion is the same way in combat. You have to regulate the emotion so that you don’t get tunnel vision and become so affixed to the danger that you can’t use your intellect. Martial Artists have to overcome this same thing to fight properly.

The emotion is not bad, it just has to be kept in control so that you can act. If shots ring out and you have ZERO emotion then why would you even act?

The emotion makes you think “oh shoot my family and I can die and I don’t want that so let me act”. You’re denigrating the importance of emotion because you over value intellect.

I don't think emotion is bad or that it is less important than intellect. I simply see it for what it is. Emotion has great purpose in many aspects of our life, no argument there but tapping into your emotions is not a solution for rational issues unless you are a women or a child. A women's emotional state is constantly changing. It can be calm for a moment and out of nowhere it is all over the place. That is not a choice or a product of life experience that is what they are.

 

[Jay]

I don't think emotion is bad or that it is less important than intellect. I simply see it for what it is. Emotion has great purpose in many aspects of our life, no argument there but tapping into your emotions is not a solution for rational issues unless you are a women or a child. A women's emotional state is constantly changing. It can be calm for a moment and out of nowhere it is all over the place. That is not a choice or a product of life experience that is what they are.

You said “tapping into your emotions is not a solution for rational issues”. Life does not present rational or emotional issues though. Life simply presents issues and it is on us to resolve them.

In order to resolve them you need both your emotional and intellectual function to work in unison. For instance, we need to solve the problem of world hunger.

If you think of it purely logically, it would make more sense to kill off the disabled, the old, and the unproductive. We could reduce the number of mouths to feed by a billion easily. It’s perfectly logical but that’s why you need emotion to provide those other inputs e.g. how others would feel about losing their loved ones, what will public sentiment about you be after the purge, how will you feel killing all those people. Apply emotional thought into that was not feminine or irrational, it actually stopped a genocide.


Without emotion…

• Why wear good looking clothes? It’s more logical to use as little resources as possible. Why not cut holes in a burlap sack and wear that?
• Why season food? It’s purely a sustenance endeavor. Enjoyment is emotion and not needed.

Women simply rely less on their logical function when in the protection of a competent man. But once again logical and emotional are both systems we possess and need. Men are basically fueled on a day to day basis by our emotional thoughts. If we weren’t we would be a lot more simple.

 

[educatedman23]

A rational thinker is somebody who reasons their way through something.

 

[Tati 304]

A rational thinker is somebody who reasons their way through something.

If Keep It Simple Stupid was a comment this would be it. No need to turn it into a math problem.

 

[Tati 304]

We are two halves of the same whole. A man CANNOT gain emotional stability without first learning it through a women. Boys who have no or bad relationship with women grow up to be maniacs. I am not saying men do not need to understand their emotions but please understand we can NEVER gain this on our own. Their is a reason why incels spend all their time hating women and targeting them with violence. Expecting a man to be of high emotional intelligence on his own is the same as expecting a man to be a women and that expectation is usually out of fear. Women are rejecting their responsibility because it forces them to be vulnerable. You can't claim men suppressing their emotions is wrong, then say men need to be calm when we are scared. What you don't understand is it is not supression it's a survival instinct. It comes natural to men. You believe you understand it but you don't. You don't have a high rational stability because you are not a man.

Was your father in your life from 1 to age 18?

 

[ChiefRocka]

You said “tapping into your emotions is not a solution for rational issues”. Life does not present rational or emotional issues though. Life simply presents issues and it is on us to resolve them.

In order to resolve them you need both your emotional and intellectual function to work in unison. For instance, we need to solve the problem of world hunger.

If you think of it purely logically, it would make more sense to kill off the disabled, the old, and the unproductive. We could reduce the number of mouths to feed by a billion easily. It’s perfectly logical but that’s why you need emotion to provide those other inputs e.g. how others would feel about losing their loved ones, what will public sentiment about you be after the purge, how will you feel killing all those people. Apply emotional thought into that was not feminine or irrational, it actually stopped a genocide.


Without emotion…

• Why wear good looking clothes? It’s more logical to use as little resources as possible. Why not cut holes in a burlap sack and wear that?
• Why season food? It’s purely a sustenance endeavor. Enjoyment is emotion and not needed.

Women simply rely less on their logical function when in the protection of a competent man. But once again logical and emotional are both systems we possess and need. Men are basically fueled on a day to day basis by our emotional thoughts. If we weren’t we would be a lot more simple.

You said “tapping into your emotions is not a solution for rational issues”. Life does not present rational or emotional issues though. Life simply presents issues and it is on us to resolve them.

In order to resolve them you need both your emotional and intellectual function to work in unison. For instance, we need to solve the problem of world hunger.

If you think of it purely logically, it would make more sense to kill off the disabled, the old, and the unproductive. We could reduce the number of mouths to feed by a billion easily. It’s perfectly logical but that’s why you need emotion to provide those other inputs e.g. how others would feel about losing their loved ones, what will public sentiment about you be after the purge, how will you feel killing all those people. Apply emotional thought into that was not feminine or irrational, it actually stopped a genocide.


Without emotion…

• Why wear good looking clothes? It’s more logical to use as little resources as possible. Why not cut holes in a burlap sack and wear that?
• Why season food? It’s purely a sustenance endeavor. Enjoyment is emotion and not needed.

Women simply rely less on their logical function when in the protection of a competent man. But once again logical and emotional are both systems we possess and need. Men are basically fueled on a day to day basis by our emotional thoughts. If we weren’t we would be a lot more simple.

You said “tapping into your emotions is not a solution for rational issues”. Life does not present rational or emotional issues though. Life simply presents issues and it is on us to resolve them.

In order to resolve them you need both your emotional and intellectual function to work in unison. For instance, we need to solve the problem of world hunger.

If you think of it purely logically, it would make more sense to kill off the disabled, the old, and the unproductive. We could reduce the number of mouths to feed by a billion easily. It’s perfectly logical but that’s why you need emotion to provide those other inputs e.g. how others would feel about losing their loved ones, what will public sentiment about you be after the purge, how will you feel killing all those people. Apply emotional thought into that was not feminine or irrational, it actually stopped a genocide.


Without emotion…

• Why wear good looking clothes? It’s more logical to use as little resources as possible. Why not cut holes in a burlap sack and wear that?
• Why season food? It’s purely a sustenance endeavor. Enjoyment is emotion and not needed.

Women simply rely less on their logical function when in the protection of a competent man. But once again logical and emotional are both systems we possess and need. Men are basically fueled on a day to day basis by our emotional thoughts. If we weren’t we would be a lot more simple.

I don't believe it is healthy for a man to constantly suppress his emotions, in fact I am certain it is not but men have created and molded societies with rational thought. Emotion can and does inspire but their is no emotion in math, science, physics ext. What is right or wrong, good or bad is irrelevant in regards to what things simply are and men are naturally logical creatures. It would be unhealthy to teach a young boy to abandon his rational mind in favor of emotion, which is common practice these days. It would be malpractice for a man not to train his sons and daughters rational mind.

Was your father in your life from 1 to age 18?

Yes.

 

[Jay]

I don't believe it is healthy for a man to constantly suppress his emotions, in fact I am certain it is not but men have created and molded societies with rational thought. Emotion can and does inspire but their is no emotion in math, science, physics ext. What is right or wrong, good or bad is irrelevant in regards to what things simply are and men are naturally logical creatures. It would be unhealthy to teach a young boy to abandon his rational mind in favor of emotion, which is common practice these days. It would be malpractice for a man not to train his sons and daughters rational mind.

Yes.

This is how Anglo-Saxons think which is why it has been so easy for them to dominate and enslave the world.

I’m not saying that either is better like you are saying. I’m saying YOU NEED BOTH. Being too rational is just as deficient as being too emotional.

Men are naturally both Logical and Emotional but our societal role causes us to have to lean into our logical more so than Women.

Why do you have scientist that try to prove that Egypt was made by White people when the people themselves said they were Black and ancient Greeks and Macedonians said they were too? Because there is emotion in science.

Because you cannot subtract emotion from the man. Emotion is tied into the human experience and is present in everything man creates.

 

[Deleted member 191]

Are these women looking for a father in an intimate partner? Are these men raised raised by single mothers looking for a mother in intimate partner relationships? Are adult men and women capable of growing past these insecure behaviors?

Are these women looking for a father in an intimate partner? : The short answer is yes. But you're asking this question like there's some once size fits all answer. Some women come from healthy family systems but kids don't always end up following the foundation and example their parents set for them, so they end up rebelling and make shitty choices that reflect the opposite of their upbringing. Some women have great upbringings, but that doesn't preclude them from experiencing trauma that changes them in ways they never truly recover from. Now is it usually due to a lack of a father and an unstable home-life, yes it is but is it always, no.

Are these men raised raised by single mothers looking for a mother in intimate partner relationships? Again I could simply restate my answer from above and apply it here. The short answer is yes. But there is no one size fits all answer. My ex lost his mom at a young age, and his father was murdered. He was raised by his grandmother who didn't raise him with discipline. Doesn't mean he wasn't loved and cared for. But he was raised the way a grandparent raises a grandchild and not the way a parent would raise their child, so he spent most of his formative years doing what he wanted with no consequence. He becomes an adult with that same immaturity I can do what I want with impunity but NOW he's engaging with women and dating and that immaturity is rearing its head in his relationships. So when it's time for him to be a competent man to his woman, and by competent I mean someone that woman knows she can trust in and rely on and defer to, to LEAD their relationship and possibly one day, their household, he can't because he doesn't know what that means.

You're positing questions that require nuance as if this is a 3+3=6 situation. It isn't. It's indicative of having limited life experience with people from other backgrounds and family environments than your own. Which means your world view and positions are from that narrow place at the moment.

Are adult men and women capable of growing past these insecure behaviors? I don't know if you're being serious or not(I hope not but I sadly think you are) but, look kid, this isn't a matter of capability. Capability reflects the likelihood you can do something and do it well. For Example: A team's capability to make the post-season this upcoming season.

Your question, is a matter of WILLINGNESS. Do they want to do what needs to be done to evolve and grow from their traumatic experiences. For example: Are the Lakers' willing to train, get on the same page as a team and make the front office moves necessary to get to the playoffs this season?


Capability is about skill, the Willingness denotes: eagerness, desire and enthusiasm.

I believe men are by nature rational thinkers and women are by nature irrational thinkers. We are two halves of a whole and we are meant to experience and grow emotionally and mentally from one another. Typically if a women has strong relationships with men growing up she will have a greater ability to function rationally and men who have strong relationships with women have a greater emotional stability. I think we make the mistake in modern times of adopting ideologies like MGTOW and feminism that attempt to force men and boys to behave like women and vise versa women and girls to behave like men. The intent is to bring us closer together but It is based in fear and self preservation.

Men and Women, by nature are men and women. Unless we are in home environments that emphasize certain things and perpetuate certain energies and dynamics within the family system (or the household in general), neither is more or less rational than the other. Rational and Irrational are learned character traits. If a man is "naturally" rational then it was emphasized in his upbringing/environment. If women are "naturally" irrational then it was emphasized in her upbringing/environment.

What I think is happening here is YOU don't know what rational and irrational means as well as you think you do. I think you might be meaning men tend to be more REALISTIC and women tend to be more DRAMATIC.

Rational means prudent, sensible, based in common-sense. Irrational means unfounded, absurd or baseless(much like this post you created, but I digress). By your definition Men behave and make decisions sensibly and with common-sense and women "fly by the seat of their pants" all their life.

Your logic in action: A man who decides to leave a toxic work environment is a rational, common sense decision but if a woman does it, she's making an irrational, unfounded, absurd decision?

I'm going to be frank with you young brotha, at minimum, you sound like those intellectual masturbators who get on Twitterspaces for 8 hours because you ain't got a job. At best, you're someone who has had very ineffective leadership in your home-life leading to unsuccessful growth opportunities in your adult life. And although you're trying to figure it out on your own you're coming up with these way out in left field conclusions with clearly flawed logic.

many black women have expressed that our relationships are lacking particularly in their emotional fulfillment. This is in my opinion what draws many of them to these backwards ways of thinking. Many women attempt to appeal to a mans emotions, thinking this is the best way to express what their needs are but they don't see that we are not emotional thinkers and they fail to get through to us.

This all sounds like sophomoric bullshit to me. But maybe somebody buys it.
If I'm in a relationship with a man and he can't show me affection, that is to say: he can't hug me, kiss me, fuck me, or tell me he loves me like he means it, then you are DAMN RIGHT I'M NOT BEING EMOTIONALLY FULFILLED. It's the bare fucking minimum in any relationship! (Seriously question: were you in a two parent home growing up?) It's LITERALLY the LEAST he can do to show her his appreciation. But by your definition that's me being irrational. If I can't appeal to the emotions of my man, then it's not a relationship, it's a friends-with-benefits or situation-ship, in the best of cases. Bottom-line, If a man is NOT an emotional thinker then he's a robot, or a maniac or both. Point blank period. Meaning no woman should be with him period if she values her physical and/or emotional well-being. How the hell can a man be the head of our household or at minimum take the lead in our relationship while ALSO not having any ability to think with emotion? How would I as a parent promote teaching my sons to "lead with their head after consulting with the heart" or my daughters to "trust their heart but use your smarts" if their father isn't setting the tone in the family?

I believe men are by nature rational thinkers and women are by nature irrational thinkers. We are two halves of a whole and we are meant to experience and grow emotionally and mentally from one another. Typically if a women has strong relationships with men growing up she will have a greater ability to function rationally and men who have strong relationships with women have a greater emotional stability. I think we make the mistake in modern times of adopting ideologies like MGTOW and feminism that attempt to force men and boys to behave like women and vise versa women and girls to behave like men. The intent is to bring us closer together but It is based in fear and self preservation. These women you speak of are easy targets for feminist because they are too afraid to move past their traumas and deal with the possibility of loss. Women have a lot more to lose than men before marriage and that is understandable but they don't know the only way forward is through.

We are two halves to a whole from a biological stand-point. Emotionally and Mentally we have to be on the same frequency so we can hold one another accountable respectfully. If one party is OVERLY emotional then you can't reason with them, if another is OVERLY logical, then you'll never be able to fully express yourself and be understood effectively by them. Both need to possess both and on the same wavelength to communicate the needs of one another.